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08-5-2016 17:08:57  #11


Re: Throwing and Dragging

Repartee wrote:

Kat, that's a great insight that our world is less physical - I think I had it once before but it was time for a refresher insight. 

I am reminded of Innocents Abroad. Mark Twain tells some whoppers there but he is so matter of fact about some of their travelling arrangements that I feel they are veracious, and some of his days sounded like tough days in special forces training, while he only seems to think them worthy of note that that day was more than usually unpleasant! It does not seem to occur to him he's done anything beyond the average person. Regular people physically manipulated the world more and had a better feel for the limits of physical objects, as well as better physical skill, so things which might seem harebrained or dangerous now would have been in the ordinary compass of activity then. Got it.

I've thought about which machine I might practice carriage throwing on - an office machine, definitely, neither too rickety nor too highly valued... aha!  The Royal Empress came to mind and was dismissed because of its plastic arm extension as the last machine you would violently return the carriage on. But I have a second one with a broken arm! Woohoo! Pre-modified! I'm going to toss that puppy.

When I was a kid, my mother had an Empress-her second typewriter.  She absolutely HAYYTED that thing!!  Anyway, I broke off the plastic handle "modifying" it.  I once serviced another such "modification" by replacing the leftover stub with an FP carriage lever.
 


Underwood--Speeds the World's Bidness
 

08-5-2016 18:28:50  #12


Re: Throwing and Dragging

TypewriterKing wrote:

When I was a kid, my mother had an Empress-her second typewriter. She absolutely HAYYTED that thing!! Anyway, I broke off the plastic handle "modifying" it. I once serviced another such "modification" by replacing the leftover stub with an FP carriage lever.
 

My little plan of carriage tossing is sadly awry for the intended victim was so cheap that I had never actually checked it over and now I see there are issues with the carriage, although the machine is overall in good condition and is immaculate inside. I can't understand how there could be problems. A service sticker inside show that a service call was last made in 1965 - it's not as if it had not seen service in half a century or anything like that! It apparently saw a year or two of hard use and was retired, and has been stored in a controlled environment since.

Why did you mother hate the typewriter? 


"Damn the torpedoes! Four bells, Captain Drayton".
 

08-5-2016 21:46:39  #13


Re: Throwing and Dragging

It was before I got into typewriter repair.  It was a government machine that probably saw lots of service at the local Veterans' Administration Hospital.  She got it for $25.00 in, I think, 1976.  She hated the looks.  She hated the clay colored paint.  She hated the elite type print. I think she even hated the touch.  I guess she missed the 1947 Underwood she had before.  She loaned it to a cousin of mine who was in college at the time. It finally gave up the ghost in 1979 and I inherited it.  It was one of the machines I used to study to see how it worked.  I have another one in my garage made in 1962.  It's got a bit of rust on it, but I think I can fix it up.  I myself don't see anything wrong with the Empress mechanically.  But I think that if I can get the one I have fixed up, I'd paint it a bright yellow, and put two black eyes and a black smile on it, and make it look like a typewriter smiley-face.   


Underwood--Speeds the World's Bidness
     Thread Starter
 

10-5-2016 07:53:14  #14


Re: Throwing and Dragging

KatLondon wrote:

Now our machines are elderly - they've had all the heavy use, and all the neglect, and instead of a nice service contract they have an amateur with a few Q tips, a screwdriver and a tweezer!

I sort of see it in the opposite way... The typewriters which would have broken after a few years of use have been recycled long ago.  The machines that have survived this far are the well-built ones, which have shrugged off decades of hard use and abuse.  Anything we do to them isn't likely to break them since they've been through it all a hundred times.

That said, I'm a dragger not a thrower.  Sheer typing speed isn't important when I'm hammering something out on a typewriter (computers are for speed).  It's more about taking my time and experiencing it.
 

 

10-5-2016 11:40:48  #15


Re: Throwing and Dragging

polyester wrote:

The typewriters which would have broken after a few years of use have been recycled long ago. The machines that have survived this far are the well-built ones, which have shrugged off decades of hard use and abuse. Anything we do to them isn't likely to break them since they've been through it all a hundred times. 

Sounds like a perception born from our disposable products era. In reality, typewriters that broke after only a few years use were repaired or refurbished. They were extremely expensive products in their day and were not quickly disposed of. And the machines that survived for decades may have been repaired a dozen times over their lifespan, or at least received regular maintenance to keep them working properly. Finally, typewriters that haven't yet broken (that you're aware of) despite having seen a lot of use are actually more likely to break: mechanical components don't improve with age, or even maintain a status quo indefinitely, they wear and eventually require replacement or repair.

I wouldn't describe what I do with the carriage to be either dragging or throwing: I just move it as quickly and gently to the the left margin stop as I can. I certainly don't see any reason in today's world for throwing a carriage. Such a technique is harder on the machine; during a time when speed meant money - and parts were readily available - you could understand why such a technique would have been employed, but no one who uses a typewriter today is in such a hurry that they need to "throw" a carriage and thereby unnecessarily shorten the life of their typewriter.


The pronoun has always been capitalized in the English language for more than 700 years.
 

10-5-2016 20:08:15  #16


Re: Throwing and Dragging

Uwe wrote:

... typewriters that haven't yet broken (that you're aware of) despite having seen a lot of use are actually more likely to break: mechanical components don't improve with age, or even maintain a status quo indefinitely, they wear and eventually require replacement or repair.

You may be right but polyester is describing a phenomenon known as "burn in" which can be real, though statistical rather than an effect on individual units. If I want to be really fanciful I can imagine mechanisms may occasionally improve with age by developing a work hardened surface on rubbing parts. At least for a while.

I wouldn't describe what I do with the carriage to be either dragging or throwing: I just move it as quickly and gently to the the left margin stop as I can. I certainly don't see any reason in today's world for throwing a carriage. Such a technique is harder on the machine; during a time when speed meant money - and parts were readily available - you could understand why such a technique would have been employed, but no one who uses a typewriter today is in such a hurry that they need to "throw" a carriage and thereby unnecessarily shorten the life of their typewriter.

Out of curiosity I tried out carriage throwing on an SG-1 and on my lonely Hermes 9. I got a few home runs on each where the carriage just came to a stop at the margin, but I got a disconcerting number of slams, particularly on the Olympia, so I certainly came to your conclusion quickly!
 


"Damn the torpedoes! Four bells, Captain Drayton".
 

10-5-2016 21:22:53  #17


Re: Throwing and Dragging

Repartee wrote:

Out of curiosity I tried out carriage throwing on an SG-1 and on my lonely Hermes 9. I got a few home runs on each where the carriage just came to a stop at the margin, but I got a disconcerting number of slams, particularly on the Olympia, so I certainly came to your conclusion quickly!

This was pretty much my experience as well. It is neat to watch the pros do it in the film reels, but not worth shortening the lifespan of a vintage machine. I was curious however, to see if anyone did this on a regular basis. Though it was taught in the schools, texts, and recommended by speed typists, like others have said, I figured this was due to the efficiency needed at the time, and in a period where you could easily maintain, repair and replace the machines.

Still, I am glad others chimed in about this, because I had not seen it discussed anywhere among modern users, and while I was pretty certain that my feeling was correct, I had wondered just a tad if I was being overly cautious, as all the literature really did recommend this. The few times I have tried, all I could think was, this cannot possibly be good.

The speed of the return does play a role in the very upper ends of typing speed if you are already so fast you need to find a place to shave off a little more, but I do not think this is that important to the vast majority of modern users of vintage machines. If you were trying to set a personal record, could already type 80+ net wpm over a sustained period, didn't mind the excessive wear/breakage, and dreamed of being the next Albert Tangora--then maybe.

 

11-5-2016 05:41:22  #18


Re: Throwing and Dragging

colrehogan wrote:

It depends on which machine I am using.  I'd say that most of the time, I would be a dragger.  This is especially the case for the ultra-portables, and the right side carriage return lever.  On the standards with the machines with the return lever on the left, I might be closer to a thrower with the standards if I get into a groove while writing.  Probably more of a dragger with the portables.  Of course, this doesn't apply to the electrics.

 
Having rethought what I said above, I'm not sure that anything I do would be considered throwing.  I certainly don't type that fast, nor would I truly need to.  I have found that I don't baby the machines and that I just use them as they were meant to be used.


Smith Premier typewriters are cool!
 

21-5-2016 22:36:46  #19


Re: Throwing and Dragging

Repartee wrote:

I had never heard of throwing before, and it sounds like a showy speed typing technique which has little significance for the average typist. Even the instructions are showy and make it sound more complicated than it is.

If I owned the typewriters and I saw the typists throwing the carriage over - or worse, practicing throwing the carriage - I would ask them to use the machine the way the designer intended! If carriages were meant to be hurled then manual typewriters would have been equipped with carriage brakes.

 

Most carriages are equipped with a kind of brake--but it's used on the tabulator to prevent the tab stops from being hit with too much force.  On electric typewriters, I think beginning in the 1950s, they did have a type of brake to cushion the margin stops when they came to the end.  Some actually had an "air brake."  Royal RE machines have those.  So did IBM until about 1959 when they cleverly used their centrifugal governor for the purpose.
 


Underwood--Speeds the World's Bidness
     Thread Starter
 

21-5-2016 22:48:53  #20


Re: Throwing and Dragging

SoucekFan wrote:

Repartee wrote:

Out of curiosity I tried out carriage throwing on an SG-1 and on my lonely Hermes 9. I got a few home runs on each where the carriage just came to a stop at the margin, but I got a disconcerting number of slams, particularly on the Olympia, so I certainly came to your conclusion quickly!

This was pretty much my experience as well. It is neat to watch the pros do it in the film reels, but not worth shortening the lifespan of a vintage machine. I was curious however, to see if anyone did this on a regular basis. Though it was taught in the schools, texts, and recommended by speed typists, like others have said, I figured this was due to the efficiency needed at the time, and in a period where you could easily maintain, repair and replace the machines.

Still, I am glad others chimed in about this, because I had not seen it discussed anywhere among modern users, and while I was pretty certain that my feeling was correct, I had wondered just a tad if I was being overly cautious, as all the literature really did recommend this. The few times I have tried, all I could think was, this cannot possibly be good.

The speed of the return does play a role in the very upper ends of typing speed if you are already so fast you need to find a place to shave off a little more, but I do not think this is that important to the vast majority of modern users of vintage machines. If you were trying to set a personal record, could already type 80+ net wpm over a sustained period, didn't mind the excessive wear/breakage, and dreamed of being the next Albert Tangora--then maybe.

Albert Tangora?!  Last I saw of him was on a 1936 typing book I once owned.  Ron "Typewriter" Mingo, still aeons ago, is a little more recent by 40 years.  He used a red-painted Royal FP.  He also taught typing classes.
 


Underwood--Speeds the World's Bidness
     Thread Starter
 

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